Are American Cigar Tastes Really That Different to International Cigar Tastes.

[El Presidente]

I was corresponding with a NC manufacturer last week and we were discussing an new upcoming line of cigars.

It was interesting to hear his strategy on developing the line with two blends; one for the American market and one for the international market (fuller).

My only comment was "why not just make a great cigar with a great blend" but he was adamant that such a strategy would not work. That international cigar lovers were more for a fuller blend that would not translate well to the domestic US market (and Vice Versa).

He knows his game. He is successful.

I was thinking about this on Sunday and the correspondence just played on my mind.

Are geographical tastes really different? Isn't a great cigar a great cigar be it Cuban, Nic, Honduran or Martian?

I can understand where a person being brought up on Macanudo (as an example) has an appreciation for that body and flavour profile. I just can't make that assumption in my own mind that they would not enjoy something else if exposed to it. It happens all the time.

Some of the strongest and fullest cigars I have experienced are non Cuban cigars. Few of them are balanced (to my taste) but there are some that I have enjoyed. The la Flor Dominicana lancero comes to mind.

I have never quite understood the reputation of Cuban Cigars as "strong"

Maybe I am missing the point to all of this. It just seems that delineating "American" and "International" cigar tastes is a hell of a broad brush assumption.

Enlighten me

[Rye]

I find hype generating is far more influential when it comes to who smokes what in any part of the world (except maybe the small forum cultures) and customizing or localizing marketing techniques would likely play a much different role. Cigar sales at the B&M level here (Canada) used to be much more based on the euro markets, while now, since the age of modern transport and free & instant communication, it has grossly turned into a following of what's hot & what's not south of the border.

Tastes are very personal, if one has any at all

[stogieluver]

I spent about a dozen years smoking NC's. After switching to Cuban's two years ago, I was suprised to discover that Cubans are not necessarily stronger; to the contrary. I think a lot of NC's are harsh, not stronger. I think it's easy to confuse the two, imho.

[wabashcr]

I would have thought it the other way around, just because most of the popular NCs are full bodied, and quite strong. That seems to be a selling point for those who enjoy NCs, and a criticism of those who don't. Of course you can find examples of mild and strong CCs and NCs alike, but if we're generalizing tastes, I find it a bit backward.

[zrotfus]

Interesting. I don't have the source or know the exact statistics but I've heard that here in the US the vast majority of cigar sales are to customers who smoke one cigar or less per year The tradition of the wedding cigar, celebrating births, graduation with cigars etc are very popular here still . The infrequent smoker would likely tend to a milder and easier-to-stomach cigar than most aficionados, and I wonder if this is a factor in blending for a US market.

[Walt69]

I've often speculated about the meaning of the term "fuller" in regards to cigar body/flavor. Some might say it's the nicotine content or "nic-kick". Others might say it's the amount of pepper/spice bite a cigar has. I like to think of "fullness" as the actual "INTENSITY" of the flavors a cigar has, whether it be with pepper/spice, coffee/cocoa, or even creamy/wood-like flavors. Also, i think it would be a good idea to have a distinction between a cigars body and strength when descriptions are made. I've had sticks that we're just a hint creamy or just a hint peppery that put me on my butt with the vitamin-n so i would call it mild-fullness but full strength "if that makes sense." I've also had some sticks with an insane amount of pepper/spice but didn't hit me at all nic-wise which i would call full-bodied but little/no strength.

I could see a problem developing with the strength assessments though, as it seems everybody tolerates nicotine differently.

Anyways i've only recently been introduced to the world of CCs, and from my own experiences i'd say there is quite a difference in what is considered full for NC to what is considered full for CC in terms of flavor profile.

Just my .02 but it seems to me it would be the opposite if they we're trying to appeal to the appropriate markets. The most intense NCs to me are a fair bit more intense than the most intense CCs i've had "Bolis, Partys, etc..."

[gtejada]

Perhaps his philosophy is why NCs fall short in making great cigars!

[Colt45]

It just seems that delineating "American" and "International" cigar tastes is a hell of a broad brush assumption.

Of course it is, and quite shortsighted. ( I'd surely be interested in trying both versions )

Given the number of monolithic power sticks, I'd have assumed just the opposite. When manufacturers generalize, they ultimately sell people short. I've said it before - I know NC producers can ( and I'm sure some do ) produce balanced, flavorful cigars. I just wish more would. But I guess I understand that in the end, it comes down to marketing / return on investment - NC producers are not alone in this....

P.S. squeaky wheels usually get the grease

[JohnS]

Yes it's odd for us exposed to the joy of Cuban cigars but American tastes in cigars are just different generally. Remember, they had the whole worldwide Candela (green) wrapper market practically as recently as the 1960s.

[FLB03TT]

I smoked NCs, almost exclusively from '95- '12. Bought CCs on vacation in Mexico, the Caribbean, etc. during this period.

The Opus X line was, essentially, un- smokeable for me- far too "strong" in my nomenclature. Don't know if it was nicotine content or what, but they put me on my ass and weren't enjoyable. Had several Nicaraguans with similar, if slightly lesser, "strength" and harsher and less balanced than the Opus X. The Dominican Puro Opus was, arguably a better cigar than the Nicaraguans but both were too much for me.

In the last three years of CC exploration I have have yet to encounter any stick over a dozen marca that have had the "strength" of the Opus or select Nics.

So the approach of the NC manufacturer is surprising, assuming that the "American market" is primarily populated by NC smokers.

[Jones]

I find hype generating is far more influential when it comes to who smokes what in any part of the world (except maybe the small forum cultures) and customizing or localizing marketing techniques would likely play a much different role. Cigar sales at the B&M level here (Canada) used to be much more based on the euro markets, while now, since the age of modern transport and free & instant communication, it has grossly turned into a following of what's hot & what's not south of the border.

Tastes are very personal, if one has any at all

I agree, people like what you tell them to like.

[Dimmers]

Just wondering aloud....could it be that the NC manufacturer makes his international blend 'fuller' because international customer are not as likely to smoke fresh?

[TheLiquidGator]

Honduran cigars taste like muddy dirt to me.

[Maplepie]

I will copy and post something I commented on from another forum I frequent. I think it fits very, very well here:

"Remember in Soviet Russia when they realised smoking was a toll on their centralised healthcare? They decided to make cigarettes taste TERRIBLE and Soviet cigarettes were known worldwide to be tar sticks with filters. The Commies, rather than give up smoking, just got used to them. So much that when the curtain collapsed, they had to get used to "good" cigarettes again because they lacked the power and harshness.
I figure the Americans will be like this with the majority of their smokes. They need a cigar that tastes like a cigarette to get their fix.

This won't take long to fix, mind you. Just the newer generation of cigar smokers should develop a palate again for the rich flavours of Cuban tobacco instead of the harsh brute force of Non-Cuban ligeros."

[TiminBC]

Generally speaking generalizations are usually either out dated or wrong or so it seels to me

I honestly thought the opposite was true.

Seems to me the big NC companies soot for the middle and market either way.

[Rushman]

I think it's a gimmick. By and large what I see on the shelves in US b&m's I wouldn't smoke just because it was off putting to me. Too friggin big, too friggin blingy etc. Don't get me wrong I love a good many NC's but the average consumer (in any line of business) is uninformed IMHO. I've not smoked too many NC's that I thought were TOO FULL bodied. I've smoked some unsmokesble mangy sticks but not because they were too strong. What most but not all NC's lack and most but not all Ccs have is character, body, varied flavour profiles, a flavor journey if you will. I truly think the average smoker smokes and enjoys turds (again IMHO) because that's what they know and they don't know to like any better. Just like the USSR cigarette analogy earlier in the thread.

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[bigharpoon]

I find it terribly hard to believe the American market is the lighter body market and the International market is the fuller body market. So many NC cigars are ligero bombs that would turn a seasoned CC smoker green I just find his strategy going counter to reality.

[AlBaron]

I will copy and post something I commented on from another forum I frequent. I think it fits very, very well here:

"Remember in Soviet Russia when they realised smoking was a toll on their centralised healthcare? They decided to make cigarettes taste TERRIBLE and Soviet cigarettes were known worldwide to be tar sticks with filters. The Commies, rather than give up smoking, just got used to them. So much that when the curtain collapsed, they had to get used to "good" cigarettes again because they lacked the power and harshness.

I figure the Americans will be like this with the majority of their smokes. They need a cigar that tastes like a cigarette to get their fix.

This won't take long to fix, mind you. Just the newer generation of cigar smokers should develop a palate again for the rich flavours of Cuban tobacco instead of the harsh brute force of Non-Cuban ligeros."

I can personally vouch for the correctness of this quote. It took me about 2 years to "get used to" Malboros

[Maplepie]

I can personally vouch for the correctness of this quote. It took me about 2 years to "get used to" Malboros

Did you used to live under the Iron Curtain?

Moved to Chicago, now??

[AlBaron]

My family moved to Chicago in 92

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[riazp]

I find cubans to be alot more balanaced in flavors when NC's. I find them to be one dimentional and focus too much on in your face strength. THere are few Nica's that i enjoy, and the ones i do seem to be better blended. I like the regular line fuentes as well, i find the wrapper to add a plesant sweetness to the cigar itself

[dchapman]

It's my impression that American taste are different in some respects. Being an American who smokes as many CCs as NCs, I find that strong/full bodied cigars widely consumed in the American market are considerably stronger than what is considered to be strong/full bodied in international markets.

I think the Cubans have the best tobacco, but they don't always make the best cigars.

[Habanos2000]

It was interesting to hear his strategy on developing the line with two blends; one for the American market and one for the international market (fuller).

If you define "fuller" as having more body and complexity, then I can see why he would think the American market would require something different. My guess is that most cigars smokers in the States associate sheer strength with a cigar being good and therefore in order to be successful you'd have to go that route.

[earthson]

No offense to your friend, of course, but the American vs International reasoning doesn't gel with me. At the very least, it's an approach to advertising rather than a custom-fit to the prevailing palate. For whatever reason, Dominican, Honduran, and Nicaraguan manufacturers have focused on rushing countless brands to market, often charging too much for the quality they deliver, and trading hype for - it seems - a balanced blend.

A good cigar is a good cigar. Sure, we all prefer different smokes, but the folks who both like the same brand/blend/vitola tend to like it for the same reasons - the same flavors, aromas, strength level, body, etc. This makes me think that cigar preference is irrespective of local cuisine, customs, culture, ethnicity, etc.

[KRunch61]

Like a lot of people, I started out smoking NCs. Been smoking mostly CCs now for the past 4-5 years and find them to be more balanced. As for fuller, even the Bolis and Partys lack the punch of many of the full-bodied NCs. Gotta say, though, every now and then it's fun to light up an ass-kickin' Diesel or Opus!