Intel on new codes

[Bijan]

Just now, Tstew75 said:

It will be really hard to confirm this, as all provincial codes are.

I will say in your favor that I've opened about 10 blind boxes of 2020 PSD4s, and 80% of them have been SOU.  UEB was used for a bunch of D4s in the past, and they always looked really, really good. I also had magical MSPEs from UEB in 17/18.

Yes I noticed on the PSD4/5/6. My methodology was as follows, I have a list of boxes with box codes from a vendor. I looked up all SOU boxes and noted the vitolas (21 vitolas found, including PSD4/D5/D6). Then I looked for all the box code for each of those vitolas in 2019 up until when SOU came around. UEB was the most prevalent. 13/21 were found under UEB previously in my list. The next most code is MSU at 6/21, but we know MSU->TUA so that's out. Next one ares are: ABO, TSM, UBM at 5/21.

Also looked at the reverse how many different vitolas there were under UEB in 2019, and what happened to those boxes. This also supported UEB->SOU (otherwise maybe UEB is making everything, so that is why it matched previously).

Also looked at the relative frequency of UEB and SOU and it looked about right, although maybe a little less SOU than expected compared to how frequent UEB was. Anyways given this data I'm confident UEB is the most likely.

[Tstew75]

2 minutes ago, Bijan said:

Yes I noticed on the PSD4/5/6. My methodology was as follows, I have a list of boxes with box codes from a vendor. I looked up all SOU boxes and noted the vitolas (21 vitolas found, including PSD4/D5/D6). Then I looked for all the box code for each of those vitolas in 2019 up until when SOU came around. UEB was the most prevalent. 13/21 were found under UEB previously in my list. The next most code is MSU at 6/21, but we know MSU->TUA so that's out. Next one ares are: ABO, TSM, UBM at 5/21.

Also looked at the reverse how many different vitolas there were under UEB in 2019, and what happened to those boxes. This also supported UEB->SOU (otherwise maybe UEB is making everything, so that is why it matched previously).

Also looked at the relative frequency of UEB and SOU and it looked about right, although maybe a little less SOU than expected compared to how frequent UEB was. Anyways given this data I'm confident UEB is the most likely.

Nice work! 

Now if we just knew what factory that was ?

[Bijan]

4 minutes ago, Tstew75 said:

Nice work! 

Now if we just knew what factory that was ?

An interesting project to unravel all the factory codes would be to carry out this sort of analysis that I did all the way back 20 years. Then the factory codes were not random but fixed. @El Presidente probably has the data in his files on box codes and vitolas. Otherwise if I had enough free time I could scrape the internet for box codes.

[Markspring1978]

1 hour ago, Bijan said:

An interesting project to unravel all the factory codes would be to carry out this sort of analysis that I did all the way back 20 years. Then the factory codes were not random but fixed. @El Presidente probably has the data in his files on box codes and vitolas. Otherwise if I had enough free time I could scrape the internet for box codes.

Some more data for your unraveling project:

https://www.cubancigarwebsite.com/packaging/information#Factory_Codes
 

[Bijan]

46 minutes ago, Markspring1978 said:

Some more data for your unraveling project:

https://www.cubancigarwebsite.com/packaging/information#Factory_Codes
 

Thanks! Looking back at 2000-2003 codes it looks like you wouldn't be able to figure out exact factories. Sets of half a dozen codes were shared between two or three factories. Still would be interesting to do. At a minimum it would be nice to figure out the mother factory codes in the period 2003-2020.

[Markspring1978]

15 minutes ago, Bijan said:

Thanks! Looking back at 2000-2003 codes it looks like you wouldn't be able to figure out exact factories. Sets of half a dozen codes were shared between two or three factories. Still would be interesting to do. At a minimum it would be nice to figure out the mother factory codes in the period 2003-2020.

 

[Fugu]

13 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Some tradition, some practical

... and out of necessity.

With the closing and continual swapping of localities, Havana city factories being down from about ten at the turn of the century to now a mere five, there isn’t much option to choose from really. More than „tradition“ it is their inability in long-term maintenance of value.

On 12/12/2020 at 7:09 PM, chuckpnoy said:

I wonder what determines which marca comes out of which factory (ie.  Partagas and Upmann vitolas coming from other “mother” factories)?

Historically, they initially all started out from their original places under their respective private ownership (bar Cohiba and later creations, for obvious reasons). That‘s why we find a bit of that still today. From then on, a slow but steady consolidation effect set in.

[Fugu]

4 hours ago, Tstew75 said:

It will be really hard to confirm this, as all provincial codes are. Some lists mention UEB as a secondary Partagas factory code, but until it's proven otherwise I'm sticking to the old notion that there's only one mother factory code at a time.

I will say in your favor that I've opened about 10 blind boxes of 2020 PSD4s, and 80% of them have been SOU. They've been nice, but not gorgeous.  UEB was used for a bunch of D4s in the past, and they always looked really, really good. I also had magical MCPEs from UEB in 17/18.

If you want to find out what Partagas is, really the toughest option is it to look for D4s.... as one of the highest-volume production cigars they tend to be made all over the place.

For Partagas best check BPC or BCJ, or MdO4 (when they were in production), as these have always been Partagas-made.

[NSXCIGAR]

5 hours ago, Tstew75 said:

I also had magical MCPEs from UEB in 17/18.

I had a bunch of UEB ABR 18s with great flavor but the most unbelievably fireproof wrappers you can believe. Multiple boxes, all in 10s. 

[Tstew75]

48 minutes ago, NSXCIGAR said:

I had a bunch of UEB ABR 18s with great flavor but the most unbelievably fireproof wrappers you can believe. Multiple boxes, all in 10s. 

All of mine were 25ct, mostly 17s & early 18s. I didn't come across any crazy wrappers that you describe!

[Tstew75]

2 hours ago, Fugu said:

If you want to find out what Partagas is, really the toughest option is it to look for D4s.... as one of the highest-volume production cigars they tend to be made all over the place.

For Partagas best check BPC or BCJ, or MdO4 (when they were in production), as these have always been Partagas-made.

Oh for sure, there's not many MSU/TUA D4s to be found. I hope I wasn't inferring that.

It's just interesting that FOH's own historical factory code list shows LMB, ETP, MSU, BUP & UEB as 17/18/19 Partagas codes. Hard to prove that any of those outside of MSU are actually Partagas.

[CigarZen]

I noticed some RASCC with SOU code up for sale on 24:24.  I have bought these RA for many years and have always been made at Partagas, as I understand exclusively.  This may be a good indication ?

[Tstew75]

2 hours ago, CigarZen said:

I noticed some RASCC with SOU code up for sale on 24:24.  I have bought these RA for many years and have always been made at Partagas, as I understand exclusively.  This may be a good indication ?

Looking at some currently avail codes for RASCC...MSU/TUA, EPM, LEP, LGB, OER, SOP, UMR. Def inconclusive, as they're rolled all over.

Now if we ever see a SOP code for RAS, that would be the kicker. I'm pretty sure they're only rolled at Partagas ?

[NSXCIGAR]

6 hours ago, CigarZen said:

I noticed some RASCC with SOU code up for sale on 24:24.  I have bought these RA for many years and have always been made at Partagas, as I understand exclusively.  This may be a good indication ?

A large percentage of RASCC is rolled at Partagas but is pretty widely dispersed. Same with RASS. I've found most RAS is rolled at Partagas however. Almost all LGC, BPC, BCJ is Partagas. Very little BBF is Partagas and as I recall very little if any BCG was from Partagas in the final years of 14-16. 

[CigarZen]

4 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

A large percentage of RASCC is rolled at Partagas but is pretty widely dispersed. Same with RASS. I've found most RAS is rolled at Partagas however. Almost all LGC, BPC, BCJ is Partagas. Very little BBF is Partagas and as I recall very little if any BCG was from Partagas in the final years of 14-16. 

Interesting. — I must only pick those from known Partagas codes.  
 

Thanks for clarification.

[asmazda]

Any idea what factory GEL code is?  I have March 2020 PSD4.

[Fezztone]

22 hours ago, asmazda said:

Any idea what factory GEL code is?  I have March 2020 PSD4.

I was just searching for that too! I just received GEL July 2020 Esplendidos

[Tstew75]

23 hours ago, asmazda said:

Any idea what factory GEL code is?  I have March 2020 PSD4.

 

1 hour ago, Fezztone said:

I was just searching for that too! I just received GEL July 2020 Esplendidos

There's no real way to know, especially this early on. Chances are its provincial.

[asmazda]

Is the consensus that SOU = UEB box code?

[Tstew75]

1 hour ago, asmazda said:

Is the consensus that SOU = UEB box code?

The fact is no one will ever know this with certainty.  So many variables in non-mother-factory-code translations (IE, outside the BIG 4 codes). 

[Woody Hayes]

Just received my April 20 Trini Esmeralda's from factory: GLE.

[Habana Mike]

On 12/16/2020 at 2:35 PM, Bijan said:

Thanks! Looking back at 2000-2003 codes it looks like you wouldn't be able to figure out exact factories. Sets of half a dozen codes were shared between two or three factories. Still would be interesting to do. At a minimum it would be nice to figure out the mother factory codes in the period 2003-2020.

This is fairly thorough through 2014:

ORIGINAL CUBAN FACTORY AND DATE CODES 1985 – 1998

Havana Factories - F?bricas de La Habana
Ciudad de La Habana - Havana
BM - Briones Montoto, formerly Romeo y Julieta
CB - Carlos Bali?o, formerly El Rey del Mundo
EH - El Habanero
EL - El Laguito (Cohiba)
FPG - Francisco P?rez Germ?n, formerly Partag?s
FR - Miguel Fern?ndez Roig, formerly La Corona
JCS - Juan Cano Sainz, formerly Por Larra?aga
FL/PL/PO - Por Larra?aga
JM - Jos? Marti, formerly H. Upmann
HM - H?roes de Moncada (Jose Piedra)
LM/SLR - Las Mambisas

Provincial Factories - F?bricas de Provincias
Cienfuegos Province
CFG - Cienfuegos region (same as CFGS)
CFGS - Cienfuegos region (same as CFG)
FD/PR - Francisco Donantien, Pinar Del Rio region
LV - Las Villas region
RD - Ricardo Donatien, Pinar del Rio region
SS - Sancti-Spir?tus region
TLP - Tobacos L?zaro Pe?a, San Antonio region
TTB - Granma, Bayamo region
TTH - Holgu?n region
VC - Villa Clara, Santa Clara region (same as VSC)
VCS - Villa Santa Clara, Santa Clara region (same as VC)

DATE CODES 1985-1998

1 N
2 I
3 V
4 E
5 L
6 A
7 C
8 U
9 S
0 O

Examples:

FPG Francisco Perez German
OVSU 03/98
BMNOSA Briones Montoto 10/96
JM-NOSE Jose Marti 10/94
NISL-TLP-02 12/95 Tobias Lazaro Pena 02
VC1-ESU Villa Clara-1 4/98

YEAR 1999 FACTORY AND DATE CODES

1999 FACTORY CODES:

Havana Factories - F?bricas de La Habana
Ciudad de La Habana - Havana
EGD - Carlos Bali?o, formerly El Rey del Mundo
EDC - Briones Montoto, formerly Romeo y Julieta
EUN - El Laguito
EAT - Francisco P?rez Germ?n, formerly Partag?s
EOG - Miguel Fern?ndez Roig, formerly La Corona
ENI - H?roes de Moncada
ECA - Jos? Mart?, formerly H. Upmann
EEO - Juan Cano Sainz, formerly Por Larra?aga

Provincial Factories - F?bricas de Provincias
Cienfuegos Province
OTC - Cienfuegos I
OAI - Cienfuegos II
OOG - Cruces
OET - Cumanayagua
OIN - Lajas

Granma Province
NAT - Bayamo
NOO - Jiguan?

Holgu?n Province
UNG - Antilla
UDI - Gibara
UAN - Holgu?n I
UCE - Holgu?n II
UET - San Andr?s

La Habana Province
TEN - Artemisa I
TEC - Artemisa II
TND - Bejucal
TOU - G?ines
TAE - G?ira I
TDC - G?ira II
TIO - Quivic?n
TCI - San Antonio I
TNG - San Antonio II
TGT - San Antonio de las Vegas
TUD - San Nicol?s de Bari
TTA - Santa Cruz del Norte

Pinar del Rio Province
GDI - Candelaria
GAO - Consolaci?n del Sur
GCN - Piloto
GNU - Pinar del R?o
GOC - San Juan (Rio Seco)

Sancti-Sp?ritus Province
CEG - Arroyo Blanco
COT - Cabaigu?n
CGI - Fomento
CNE - Guayos
CTO - Jatibonico
CUN - Perea
CID - Sancti-Sp?ritus
CDU - Taguasco
CAC - Trinidad
CCA - Zaza del Medio

Santiago de Cuba Province
AGE - Santiago de Cuba

Villa Clara Province
DNU - B?ez
DDE - Camajuan?
DIT - Esperanza
DEC - Manicaragua
DGC - Placetas
DAI - Quemado de G?ines
DOD - Ranchuelo
DCO - Remedios
DTA - Santa Clara I
DAT - Santa Clara II
DNC - Santo Domingo
DUN - Vueltas

JANUARY – MAY 1999 DATE CODES

Number Code

1 N
2 E
3 T
4 A
5 G
6 I
7 D
8 O
9 C
0 U

JUNE – DECEMBER 1999 DATE CODES

Date Code

May 1999 EPOO
June 1999 ESOO
July 1999 EUOO
August 1999 EAOO
September 1999 EOOO
October 1999 LEOO
November 1999 LLOO
December 1999 LROO

NOTE: It is a known fact, that a number of factories did not utilize the June – December 1999 coding system and continued to use NETAGIDOCU coding system and to make matters even more confusing, some factories adopted a blend of both coding systems: NETAGIDOCU and NIVELACUSO. For example:

CCES 06/99
CCEU 07/99
CCAE 08/99
CCNU 10/99
CCNN 11/99
CCNT 12/99
ELOO 01/2000

YEAR 2000 DATE CODES AND BEYOND

Starting in the year 2000 the date codes have five digits: MMMYY
The first three digits “MMM” represent the month portion of the code while the last two digits "YY" represent the year.

Month Codes

English Spanish Code

January Enero ENE
February Febrero FEB
March Marzo MAR
April Abril ABR
May Mayo MAY
June Junio JUN
July Julio JUL
August Agosto AGO
September Setiembre SET
October Octubre OCT
November Noviembre NOV
December Diciembre DIC

Example:

Year Code
2000 00
2001 01
2002 02
2003 03
2004 04
2005 05
and so on....

Example Decoded

ENE00 January 2000
NOV02 November 2002
ABR00 April 2000
DIC04 December 2004

SOME OF THE KNOWN FACTORY CODES 2000-2002

LOC Carlos Balino – El Rey Del Mundo

EOG, EAR - La Corona

ECA - H. Upmann

RPO - H?roes de Moncada

OSU - Partagas

PEL - Romeo y Julieta

2000: LOME, LQME; 2001: CLE El Laguito

ARA - Jose Cano

LRL, SLA - Pinar Del Rio

PUL, URE, UPA, IESC - Holguin

URL, LES, SUA, CPV, RSE, PUC - Villa Clara

VCR, DUO, REC, PAS, USP, APE, LUL, CLO, SRA, OVU - Sancti Spiritus

CAV, ALV, SSU, VEL, SOL, PAR, SCO, LPE - La Habana

EOP, LAC, SEL, PUV - Cienfuergos

ACS, PLO - Granma

OLA - Santiago de Cuba

Some known factory codes from the year 2003 and on:

Francisco P?rez Germ?n (Partagas)
GKI - 2003
SVF - 2005
POS - 2006, 2007
TEB - 2007, 2008
LRE - 2009
POL - 2010
OGA – 2011, 2012
MUR – 2012 (MAY/JUNE), 2013
ULA – 2013, 2014

Jose Marti (H.Upmann)
LLN – 2003 -05-04
FIM - 2005
ROA - 2006
USE - 2007 - 08
MOA - 2009
MGA - 2010
SUB – 2011, 2012
UPE – 2012 (summer), 2013
LUB – 2013, 2014

Briones Montoto (Romeo y Julieta)
JNL - 2003-4
SXF - 2004-5

El Laguito
CLE 2001-03
MKO – 2003-04
PFY - 2005
PLM - 2006
MEL - 2007-08
LBT - 2009
TEU - 2010/2011
MES – 2011, 2012
BTO – 2012, 2013
MUO – 2013 (NOV), 2014

Miguel Fernandes Roig (La Corona)
EAR - 2001-3
KMM - 2003/4
FHR - 2004
FJN - 2005
OEB - 2006
EMA - 2007-08
OPM - 2009
URG -2010, 2011
MLO -2011, 2012
AME – 2012 (MAY), 2013
EML - 2013, 2014

Francisco Donantien, Pinar del Rio:
OIK - 2004
IKR - 2005
STL - 2006-07
OUR - 2008-09
OUS - 2009-10
AGR - 2010-11
MSE – 2011, 2012
LUM – 2012, 2013
SUE/APU? – 2013, 2014

?La Habana
?URO, ERO - 2008-2010? - not confirmed

SOA, SOE (2011), LOE (2012), TUO (2013) - La Habana (not confirmed)

PSM (2012-2013) - Guira

MUE, TAU, ROA, BOA, GUT (2012-2013), RMS (2012-2013) - provincial factories (not confirmed...wherever these Punch Punch/Connie #1 come from)

LEM 2011 - Carlos Bali?o (not confirmed)

According to HSA, BHKs are rolled only at El Laguito Factory for the first four months.
LBT MAR10, LBT ABR10, TEU MAY10, TEU JUN10.

The production expands to other factories, but the box codes remain TEU, as we gather the info: JUL, AUG, SEP, NOV, DEC, JAN2011... could be rolled elsewhere, but will bare the same code. New Guarantee stickers are also at play - first new stickers came from Partagas factory. MES is the new code starting in the spring of 2011 at El Laguito.

Courtesy ICC

[RDB]

Does anyone know the new code for MOL?

[Greekfreak]

On 12/11/2020 at 10:38 AM, FireDigger said:

Thanks for the link to that thread. I tried searching "RAT" but did not yield any results. Not sure if there's a minimum number of characters for the FOH search?

Upmann is GEM

[PuroDan]

Is SOU the EL factory? MAR is for sure wondering about SOU