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4 minutes ago, SigmundChurchill said:

Maybe I missed it, but there was also the 2002(ish) Trinidad Farmhouse Humidor, with 10 Fundadores and 10 Double Robustos.

Yes, at the time of the loss of trademark rights in the USA, Habanos S.A also added this stunning special release in addition to the Reyes, Coloniales and Robustos Extra. According to @ATGroom, the initial run available in Hong Kong and the United Kingdom are much, much better in quality.

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6 minutes ago, JohnS said:

Yes, at the time of the loss of trademark rights in the USA, Habanos S.A also added this stunning special release in addition to the Reyes, Coloniales and Robustos Extra. According to @ATGroom, the initial run available in Hong Kong and the United Kingdom are much, much better in quality.

It seems that Europe,  especially England gets much better quality across the board on all cuban cigars

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As a newb, it’s interesting to hear that Trinidad had really turned it around in the last five years given the reputation the Marca currently enjoys.  Were the Fundadores the lone consistent standout of the marca, or have they also seen significant improvement since 2014?

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9 minutes ago, Shrimpchips said:

As a newb, it’s interesting to hear that Trinidad had really turned it around in the last five years given the reputation the Marca currently enjoys.  Were the Fundadores the lone consistent standout of the marca, or have they also seen significant improvement since 2014?

I would say that due to the exceptional RAG/ARS 2017 to early 2019 batches that there was a definite improvement in Fundadores in comparison.

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8 hours ago, JohnS said:

I would say that due to the exceptional RAG/ARS 2017 to early 2019 batches that there was a definite improvement in Fundadores in comparison.

Awesome info, thanks.

I'm glad I'm not the only one that saw nothing but FIRE sticks from ARS in 19. Best looking Trinis ever

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@JohnS Excellent post.  I've posted this before but it seems far more relevant here. I have this envelope post marked May 1960 from a Trinidad y Hno, S.A.  As far as I can deduce.  It is located in Ranchuelo Cuba.  Which is a small town.  And I assume "Ave. Ramon Trinidad y Coronel Acebo" is an address vs names?

Anyone have any insight here?

Trinidad-Envelope-Scan-Front.jpg.4d3a8808fe12eb72c8efeb087f8a54ba.jpg

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6 hours ago, SigmundChurchill said:

 

I disagree with some of the above opinions.  I would say that Trinidad has had that "exclusive" cache ever since they were made available to the public.  It was "the other" high-end label, along with Cohiba, right from its inception.  The Fundadore was the only size available, but as other vitolas were created, the Fundadore remained the flagship vitola.  The Reyes and Coloniales were good cigars in their own right, but were never as well regarded as the Fundadores.  The Robusto Extra, on the other hand, showed the cigar world that Trinidad was no one-trick pony.  That was one of the finest cigars ever made, not just IMHO, but in the humble opinions of many, many cigar smokers.  I was shocked when it was discontinued.

Perhaps the Fundadores have had their ups and downs, but even in down years, they never lost their place in the cigar hierarchy.  But after the discontinuation of the Robusto Extra and Robusto T, Trinidad went back to being a one-trick pony again.  That is, until they came out with the La Trova.  But as an LCDH exclusive, I dont find the La Trova to have the classic Trinidad flavors.  I think the recipe has some of the same ingredients, but some different ingredients as well.  

I was very excited to have 3 new sizes come out last year, with the traditional Trinidad blend.  The Esmeralda was reminiscent of the Robusto Extra in size and to a certain degree, in flavor.  it is stronger than I remember the Robusto Extra to be, but the flavors are classic Trinidad.

LOVED the Robusto Extra, and the T for that matter. 

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56 minutes ago, bundwallah said:

@JohnS Excellent post.  I've posted this before but it seems far more relevant here. I have this envelope post marked May 1960 from a Trinidad y Hno, S.A.  As far as I can deduce.  It is located in Ranchuelo Cuba.  Which is a small town.  And I assume "Ave. Ramon Trinidad y Coronel Acebo" is an address vs names?

Anyone have any insight here?

Trinidad-Envelope-Scan-Front.jpg.4d3a8808fe12eb72c8efeb087f8a54ba.jpg

According to the New York Times obituaries the recipient died March 14th 1961. There are texts online of some lawsuits he (or his estate) brought for losses I'm assuming against Cuba.

Edit: Recipient seems to be the company owned by the aforementioned deceased gentleman.

Edit 2: According to the obituary the company was an importer of agricultural chemicals.

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On 1/4/2021 at 12:55 AM, SigmundChurchill said:

I disagree with some of the above opinions.  I would say that Trinidad has had that "exclusive" cache ever since they were made available to the public.  It was "the other" high-end label, along with Cohiba, right from its inception.  The Fundadore was the only size available, but as other vitolas were created, the Fundadore remained the flagship vitola.  The Reyes and Coloniales were good cigars in their own right, but were never as well regarded as the Fundadores.  The Robusto Extra, on the other hand, showed the cigar world that Trinidad was no one-trick pony.  That was one of the finest cigars ever made, not just IMHO, but in the humble opinions of many, many cigar smokers.  I was shocked when it was discontinued.

Part of the reason I collated this information was to put it all in one source. What began this investigation for me was the fact that I wanted to delve deeper into why the 50th anniversary releases were so outstanding and how the whole marca contrasted reputably from a period when it was in the doldrums post-2010. So, what is presented here are the main points from possibly 40 to 50 different sources (you should have seen my browser trying to cope with all that at times!).

Yes, the Fundadores is the flagship cigar. It's very name means 'foundation' in English. I didn't include the effect the 1999-2001 period in Habanos history had on the Trinidad marca here. In an effort to greatly increase export volumes in a very short period of time, the resultant tight draw issues (or frankly 'plugging') with the Trinidad Fundadores had a disastrous effect on sales. This was part of the reason why Habanos S.A brought out other vitolas in 2003/04 to re-vitalise the brand. They've always viewed the brand in light of its relationship with Cohiba as a premium marca and in light of its historical relation to the legal claims to authorship from the Trinidad family post-Revolution. Remember, Cuaba also was intended to re-vitalise premium status for perfecto cigars in the late 90s but it never came close to doing so. But with Trinidad, you've got to give Habanos S.A credit for perseverance and trying new things along the way.

The discontinuation of the Robustos Extra and Robustos T was an indirect admission by Habanos S.A that the premium status of Trinidad as a brand wasn't quite working as it was for Cohiba at that time. Compare the performance of the Trinidad Short Robusto T Limited Edition in 2010 with the Cohiba 1966 Limited Edition in 2011, for example. The Robustos Extra in itself (as a cigar) was not a failure but the performance of Trinidad in comparison to Cohiba in regards to sales was. If the Robustos Extra was a failure as a vitola then we wouldn't see it resurrected in an upcoming Special Release Travel Humidor.

On 1/4/2021 at 12:55 AM, SigmundChurchill said:

Perhaps the Fundadores have had their ups and downs, but even in down years, they never lost their place in the cigar hierarchy.  But after the discontinuation of the Robusto Extra and Robusto T, Trinidad went back to being a one-trick pony again.  That is, until they came out with the La Trova.  But as an LCDH exclusive, I don't find the La Trova to have the classic Trinidad flavors.  I think the recipe has some of the same ingredients, but some different ingredients as well. 

Actually I would agree with this. In putting a spotlight on the Fundadores from 2017 to early 2019 my intention wasn't to downplay how good they were previously; rather it was to emphasise just how outstanding they've been of late.

The La Trova not having classic Trinidad flavours? Yes, I concur with this too. It has that classic buttery texture profile but it's not as savoury as the 50th Anniversary regular production releases, for example.

On 1/4/2021 at 12:55 AM, SigmundChurchill said:

I was very excited to have 3 new sizes come out last year, with the traditional Trinidad blend.  The Esmeralda was reminiscent of the Robusto Extra in size and to a certain degree, in flavor.  it is stronger than I remember the Robusto Extra to be, but the flavors are classic Trinidad.

Yes, this is right. My opinion is that from the very beginning Habanos S.A brought out the Reyes, Coloniales and Robustos Extra to mirror the Cohiba Siglo I, Siglo II and Siglo VI in 2003/04 because these were the biggest sellers for Cohiba in that period, in the Linea 1492 line. (In fact, one could argue that this is still the case). When the 50th Anniversary releases came out in late 2019 the Esmeralda mirrored the Cohiba Siglo VI, the Media Luna mirrored the Medio Siglo (plus it was a petit robusto, the number one favoured size of Habanos S.A at the moment) and the Topes became a regular production cigar because the 2016 Limited Edition was so successful. However, you could say that the Topes is a modern enlarged re-birth of the Robustos T.

Daymi Difurniao Rodríguez, Director of Marketing for Habanos S.A in 2012, did state that the discontinuation of the Robustos Extra and Robustos T was due to its relation to Cohiba as a premium marca and would lead to a re-branding down the track as well as the release of new vitolas. Her words below...

Trinidad currently has five vitolas (sizes) in its portfolio: Fundadores (7 ½" x 40 ring gauge), Robusto Extra (6 1/8" x 50 ring gauge), Robusto 'T' (4 7/8" x 50 ring gauge), Coloniales (5 ¼" x 44 ring gauge) and Reyes (4 3/8" x 40 ring gauge). While it is true that Habanos SA has announced that the Robusto Extra and Robusto 'T' have been discontinued, both are to be replaced by new vitolas in the near future. The exact date of these two new releases, and the format they will take, are yet to be confirmed. What is clear is that, far from downgrading the brand, these decisions have been made in order to continue the development of the, relatively young, Trinidad brand and to increase its standing among cigar smokers the world over.

Within the Habanos S.A brand structure Trinidad will continue to be positioned as one of the most prestigious brands, ranked just behind Cohiba, the standard bearer for Cuban cigars.

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11 minutes ago, JohnS said:

 

Trinidad currently has five vitolas (sizes) in its portfolio: Fundadores (7 ½" x 40 ring gauge), Robusto Extra (6 1/8" x 50 ring gauge), Robusto 'T' (4 7/8" x 50 ring gauge), Coloniales (5 ¼" x 44 ring gauge) and Reyes (4 3/8" x 40 ring gauge). While it is true that Habanos SA has announced that the Robusto Extra and Robusto 'T' have been discontinued, both are to be replaced by new vitolas in the near future. The exact date of these two new releases, and the format they will take, are yet to be confirmed. What is clear is that, far from downgrading the brand, these decisions have been made in order to continue the development of the, relatively young, Trinidad brand and to increase its standing among cigar smokers the world over.

Within the Habanos S.A brand structure Trinidad will continue to be positioned as one of the most prestigious brands, ranked just behind Cohiba, the standard bearer for Cuban cigars.

Near future?  8 years later?

....Meh, Cuba time.   😂

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On 1/2/2021 at 10:19 PM, deadpair71 said:

great info!  trinidad is currently my fave marca, I hope the quality keeps on the upward trend.

me too + thanks for the info johnS

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Thanks for putting this together John! I always wondered why they changed the band right after public release, the lawsuit makes sense but I never heard that part before. 

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Yes, many thanks John. As a fan of the Marca it is good to have an understanding of the history. I'm only 10 years into my CC odyssey, and when introducing new followers I am often asked about the history of certain Marcas. Information like you have provided gives me confidence that I'm passing along accurate info as opposed to merely parroting understood generalities. 

Now if I could just find more LaTrova...

 

Big Al 

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Awesome insight John! I got the privilege to smoke an early 1990's Fundadores (Old Band) and it was the creamiest cigar I've ever smoked. From there I could understand why this marca was so celebrated by cigar smokers worldwide.  I can say the Esmeralda is a good step in the right direction for Trinidad. The one I've smoked was amazing and in my opinion better than La Trova.

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3 hours ago, dshot said:

Awesome insight John! I got the privilege to smoke an early 1990's Fundadores (Old Band) and it was the creamiest cigar I've ever smoked. From there I could understand why this marca was so celebrated by cigar smokers worldwide.  I can say the Esmeralda is a good step in the right direction for Trinidad. The one I've smoked was amazing and in my opinion better than La Trova.

Fantastic...that is quite something, judging by the huge interest in those cigars prior to public release in the late 90s. I agree, the three new releases are a step in the right direction for Trinidad, blend-wise.

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